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Liverpool Echo
Liverpool Echo
National
Adam Everett

What murder trial jury has heard so far after son stabbed mum to death outside pub

Jamie Dempsey went on trial at Liverpool Crown Court this week accused of the murder his mum Karen.

The 55-year-old was stabbed in the heart by her son near to the Brambles pub in Kirkby in summer last year as he was fighting with another man, who had earlier "glassed" him inside, over a drug debt. He then hugged her and fled the scene.

Dempsey, 32, later asked a cousin to burn the clothes he was wearing and bought beers from an off-licence before handing himself in to police. Here is what the jury was told during the first week of the trial:

READ MORE: Boy who asked 'Accrington Stanley, who are they?' grew up to be a murderer

Day 1

The prosecution's case was opened on Monday, with Peter Glenser KC telling the court the mum and son had made arrangements to meet for a drink in the pub on the evening of August 22, 2022. Dempsey, of Brechin Road, had raised concerns about potentially seeing a man called Brian Flynn at this location "as there had been unpleasantness between them nearby before".

Jurors heard that Mr Flynn "was cross with him because he had run up an unpaid drug debt of some £2,000". Messages the defendant had sent to Ms Dempsey from his girlfriend's phone beforehand described him as a "d***head" who had "dropped him outside the Tavern" previously, although he said he was not "arsed about it".

CCTV footage from inside the bar showed her sat with friends from around 7.30pm on the night in question. Mr Flynn meanwhile was situated at a table nearby, unbeknown to her.

Dempsey and his partner Sarah Van Maren entered around 10 minutes later and joined her, but "moments later" Ms Dempsey went into the foyer to call a taxi - he having apparently spotted the other man inside. Shortly after 8pm Mr Flynn returned from the toilets and hurled a glass at him, hitting him on the back of the head.

He then "followed up this assault with punches" thrown at him. Ms Dempsey and others managed to restrain him, but he picked up a second glass and again chucked it at Dempsey - who left via the back door.

Mr Flynn meanwhile was escorted out of the front exit, onto Cherryfield Drive. The accused then began walking towards this area, and another confrontation erupted.

The pair began to grapple, with Dempsey now clutching a knife in his right hand. He repeatedly stabbed Mr Flynn before a man, referred to in court only as "Male A", and Ms Dempsey attempted to intervene.

The weapon "made contact" with her chest at this point, leaving her with blood pouring down her dress. The fighting then ceased and Dempsey hugged his mum before leaving the area.

She collapsed moments later, the knife having pierced her heart and liver. Ms Dempsey was rushed to Aintree Hospital, but was pronounced dead at 9.45pm.

A "heavily bloodstained" Mr Flynn was stopped by police nearby and arrested. He too was taken to hospital after suffering significant injuries including a punctured lung, with the most serious stab wound being delivered to his left armpit.

Having fled, Dempsey walked to his aunt's house and told her there had "been a fight and he had stabbed his mother". He took off his clothing and asked his cousin to burn it, although the relative did not do so.

The knifeman then went to an off-licence and bought cans of beer. Later, Dempsey was dropped at Kirkby Police Station by a friend.

While the police station was closed, he phoned Merseyside Police "to tell them where he was and that he was wanted" - not yet knowing that he had killed his mum. During this call, he said he had used a piece of glass and not a knife during the incident.

Dempsey was heard to say in a recording played to the court: "I’ve been accused of stabbing someone tonight but I haven’t. It was in self-defence.

"There’s been an altercation. I’ve defended myself."

Dempsey also told the operator “he glassed me twice”, adding: "I was scared for my life. What do you want me to do?"

Officers then arrived at the scene, and he was heard in the background asking "can I have a ciggie?" before the call was terminated. Under interview following his arrest, and after learning of his mother's death, Dempsey changed his account and said he had found a knife by the back door of the pub after the initial altercation.

Day 2

Jurors were told of efforts to save Ms Dempsey's life in the aftermath of the incident on the second day of the trial. A statement read out to the court on behalf of Matthew Hall described how he had been closing the Training Station - a gymnasium above the nearby Flames takeaway - for the evening shortly after 8pm along with his girlfriend Whitney Johnson and friend Paul Daniels.

Mr Daniels walked ahead to his van in the car park at the rear of the row of shops, at which point he encountered the critically-injured woman. Mr Hall described how he saw him applying pressure to Ms Dempsey's chest, saying: "I instantly knew something had happened as there were people standing around, but I didn't know what - Paul said to me, 'she's been stabbed'."

He then dialled 999 and instructed Ms Johnson to head onto Cherryfield Drive and flag down any passing ambulances or police cars. Mr Hall's statement added: "I could see the woman was still breathing, however she was drifting in and out of consciousness.

"A police officer came running over to where I was stood. I have no idea what took place leading up to this incident and I do not know the woman that was on the floor."

Pathologist Dr Jonathan Medcalf was also called to give evidence on Tuesday, having conducted a post-mortem investigation following Ms Dempsey's death. He found she had sustained a "deep stab wound" to the upper left side of her chest of 2.3cm in length and 15.5cm deep "caused by a sharp, narrow bladed weapon".

Day 3

The jury was read transcripts of Dempsey's interviews with police following his arrest on Wednesday. He told detectives that Brian Flynn - who was also stabbed during the incident - had attacked him shortly before the Liverpool FC v Manchester United game was due to be shown on the television, saying: "I seen Brian in there.

"I owe him from a drug debt from about a year ago. He's knocked me out previously outside another pub in Kirkby.

"Just before the game started, he went into the toilet. He's came back out, he's glassed me."

After leaving via the back door, Dempsey claimed to have found a knife on the floor before a second confrontation with Mr Flynn. He stated: "Brian was shouting 'get here'.

"I picked the knife up. I shouted 'get away, I've got a knife'.

"He came at me and I ended up swinging the knife. I've obviously ended up hitting my mum as well."

Having dumped the weapon in a bin near to the elephant statue on Newtown Gardens, Dempsey said he then bought four cans of Fosters at Quarry Green Convenience Store on Old Rough Lane which he drank in St Chad's Gardens. He said: "I was just in a mad, crazy moment and I ran away.

"I hugged my mum and said 'I'm sorry, I didn't mean to stab you. She said 'it's ok, just go'.

"It weren't my blade, I didn't bring it. It was just in the back of the Brambles. When he started to come over to me, I picked it up just to scare him away. I said 'get away, I've got a knife' and he still came at me."

Dempsey also went to his aunt's house nearby and asked his cousin to burn the clothes he was wearing. The defendant said of this: "Obviously I was just going crazy weren't I?

"I didn't think nothing would happen to my mum. I was just trying to cover up what I done to Brian. I knew she'd been stabbed, but she was stood there talking to me. I thought it was nothing.

"She said 'it's alright, get off'. The last words she ever said to me.

"I'm sure he got on top of me first and that's when I swung the knife. I don't even remember hitting my mum, I don't ever remember my mum splitting it up.

"I told him to f*** off, 'I've got a knife, go away'. He was like 'you're getting it', that was it. I just went a bit blank when I got hit on the head, when I got glassed and that. I just wanted him to go away.

"I didn't want to hurt him, I didn't want to hurt anyone. He's done me in before and I wanted him to go away from me and leave me alone. He's saying 'I'm going to kill you, I'm going to kill your ma'. I didn't say f*** all."

Returning to the final time he saw his mum alive, Dempsey reported she had told him "Jamie look, you've stabbed me". He added: "I went 'oh my god'.

"I said 'mum, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I never meant it'.

"She said 'I know you never meant it, get off. See you later'.

"I'm a fool. I shouldn't have done none of it mate, walked away.

"They arrested me for murder. I thought I'd killed him, I didn't even think about my mum."

A statement made by his auntie Lynn Dempsey was also read out on day three. In it, she described how she was in her bedroom in her pyjamas watching television when she heard banging at the front door then found her nephew "stood there covered in blood all over his face, like he had been in a fight".

His "pupils looked quite big, like he might be high on something". As he entered and went into the bathroom and began stripping out of his clothing, an "erratic" Dempsey told her: "Don't ask, but I've just stabbed someone and I think I've stabbed me ma."

Day 4

Dempsey was called to give evidence from the witness box on Thursday. While jurors had previously heard he had owed the debt to Mr Flynn, he told them that he in fact "owed one of his friends".

The defendant described how he had been attacked previously by him at a nearby pub in March 2022 - by which time he had been "off cocaine for a few months", with the debt being "about a year old". On the stand, the dad-of-two said of this incident: "I'd never spoke to him in my life.

"He offered me a phone and said someone wants to speak to you. As I grabbed the phone, he punched me and put me on my back.

"Later on that night, I got a phone call off the person I owed the money to. Brian got on the phone and said if I didn't pay him next week, I'd be dead.

"I got rid of that phone and stopped going out. A couple of times I'd seen him from a distance and avoided him."

Dempsey said he did not pay up as he had "lost his job and was skint". On the night of his mum's death, he said that they would "just leave" if they saw Mr Flynn in the Brambles and added: "It was just a stupid idea to be honest with you.

"I don't know why I went there to be honest with you. I didn't know that's where he went all the time.

"I don't really know the man. I should have just kept away from there.

"I just said to my mum 'there's that lad there. I want to get off'.

"She said 'stay seated, I'll call us a taxi. I don't think he'll do anything while you're with all of us in the pub'.

"I didn't even realise he'd noticed I was there to be honest. We didn't know each other, the only time we'd seen each other was that one time outside the Tavern when I was pointed out to him by someone.

"I'd been in the pub that long, I thought he didn't actually know who I was. I just kept my view away from him.

"I can't remember much. I was hit on the side of the head.

"I remember jumping up and the fella grabbed me. I was bleeding from the head at first, then when the second glass was thrown I've put my hand up to block it and that hit my hand and cut my wrist."

Dempsey reported that Mr Flynn was "just shouting things at me - 'you cheeky b*****d, watch what I'm going to do to you'". He added: "He's a big fella compared to me.

"He was like, 'I'm gonna kill you. Watch when I get you'.

"I was stressed, scared. I wanted to leave."

Dempsey said he could hear Mr Flynn continue shouting outside, saying: "I could hear him shouting stuff at the front of the pub. 'I'm going to get him, where is he?', stuff like that.

"I seen the knife at the side and I thought I'll show him the knife if he comes round. He'll be scared by that.

"I seen him and he's shouted over to me 'come on then you little d***head'. I started walking over to him.

"I said to him, I showed him the knife, 'I've got a knife here, f*** off'. He put his hands up at me, just came at me.

"I was already bleeding quite a bit by that point. I can't remember much of it at all.

"I was a bit disorientated to be honest with you. I remember getting grabbed from behind, I thought I was getting choked.

"I literally thought I was going to be seriously injured or killed. He was acting like a psychopath in the pub, and outside."

Asked when he realised his mum had become involved in the altercation, Dempsey tearfully said: "I didn't, not until after she showed me her chest. Then the fight had stopped really, I think I had my eyes closed for most of the fight.

"She just grabbed me and said 'Jamie you stabbed me'. I couldn't believe what I'd just seen, and that was about it.

"I said 'mum, I'm sorry'. She said 'you're just a divvy lad, it would happen to you'.

"I gave her a hug and she said to leave. She told me to leave and get away from there.

"I was a bit erratic. I was in shock to be honest with you, with what I'd done to my mum and to Brian.

"I didn't want to do any of it, I just wanted to get away from him. I regret it more than anything in the world, what I've done.

"She was my rock, she was the only person in the world that's been there all my life - my best friend to be honest with you.

"I loved her more than anything. Absolutely brilliant she was, best nan in the world."

Of the moment he was arrested on suspicion of murder, Dempsey said: "I actually thought it was Brian. When I'd left my mum, she was so strong.

"She told me it was nothing, she'd be alright. I thought it was Brian."

As Dempsey was led back to the dock following cross-examination, he turned to his family in the public gallery and said: "I'm sorry. Properly sorry."

Day 5

The trial did not sit on Friday.

What will happen next week?

The prosecution and defence cases have now closed, with jurors expected to retire to consider their verdicts early next week. Dempsey, who is being represented by Timothy Cray KC, denies murder, and the trial, before Judge Dennis Watson KC, continues.

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