May says EU citizens will not be kicked out, but refuses to say she'd vote for Brexit
The prime minister faced the public for the first time since her party conference speech.
She said talks needed to continue to determine the exact circumstances under which they would live but said: “We’re not going to be throwing EU citizens ... out of the UK in the future.”
She was asked four times whether she would vote for Brexit if the referendum were rerun today - and she declined to answer four times.
And, on the day of the racial disparity audit, she indicated she did not believe stop and search powers had been properly deployed, adding that no one should be stopped and searched based on the colour of their skin.
You can read a brief summary of the party conference by the SNP leader, Nicola Sturgeon, here.
Or, for a more in-depth view, read Severin Carrell’s story:
This live blog is now closing - thanks for joining us.
Asked about the job losses at BAE, May says it is an “extremely worrying time for [those workers]” and says the government will try to help them into alternative employment. She also refers to a memorandum of intent signed by the defence secretary paving the way for the Qatari government to buy British munitions, which she suggested could help.
Ending the session, she says the international trade secretary, Liam Fox, would be the cabinet colleague she’d most like to have keep her company on a desert island. This, she says, is because - as a doctor - he is likely to be quite practical and she’s recently had a cough.
Theresa May accuses Jeremy Corbyn of making promises but not backing up how he’d deliver on them. For balance, the Labour party had argued its manifesto at the last election was fully costed.
May reiterates she does intend to lead her party into the next general election.
Asked about rumours of a reshuffle, she says: “Everybody can speculate away to their heart’s content.” And, pressed about Boris Johnson’s position in particular, she says: “Boris is foreign secretary,” adding that he agreed with her speech in Florence, as did the rest of the cabinet.
Iain Dale repeatedly asks Theresa May whether she’d still vote to remain in the EU today and she repeatedly refuses to answer, saying it’s a hypothetical question and insisting she’ll deliver Brexit.
Asked about Osborne’s reported comments about wanting her chopped up and in his freezer, May repeats her joke from the conference, saying she’s been described as an “ice maiden” but believes Osborne’s reported line went a bit far.
May is asked about a story reporting that talks will not take place tomorrow because British officials are not available to get round the table. May says she believes talks were not scheduled for tomorrow.
May: 'We won't throw EU citizens out of the UK after Brexit'
The call-in moves to Brexit.
A caller from an EU member state calls about what happens to EU citizens in the case of no deal being agreed.
“We want you to stay,” May says. But she adds there are discussions going on about “reciprocity of treatment”. She’s asked to clarify what happens in the case of there being no deal. She will only say the government is looking at that.
Why can she not say people can stay under any circumstance? May says there are rights, such as benefits entitlements, that would need to be looked at if there was no deal. “We’re not going to be throwing EU citizens who are currently here in the UK out of the UK in the future,” she says.
EU member states would also have to consider what happens to British citizens living there, she adds.
May says she hasn’t experienced discrimination herself but some of her colleagues have and she hopes she can understand those who face it every day.
May: 'Use stop and search properly'
May says stop and search is an important tool for the police but “should be used properly” and a recent study found a significant proportion of stops were effectively illegal. She adds that no one should be stopped and searched based on the colour of their skin.
Dale says the Tory party is not representative and asks if it should not be leading by example. “Look at what we’re doing,” May responds. She says the party has new MPs from BAME backgrounds but that Conservative policies need to improve the lives of people from such communities for it to attract them.
Updated
A caller, Carl, says he has experienced racism at the hands of the police, though he believes the problems posed by racism have eased in recent years. But Carl, who is mixed race, says there is racist news coverage by media organisations and asks May to look into that in more detail.
“Interesting point about the media,” May replies, saying she has heard people from BAME communities complain about a lack of positive role models and media organisations should highlight more positive stories involving people from such backgrounds.
Asked about affirmative action, May says she has presided over changes to recruitment practices in the police as home secretary. She adds that she “hasn’t looked at the possibility” of making blind CVs compulsory, adding she prefers working towards employers wanting to make changes, rather than forcing them through.
The next question is from a listener on the racial disparity audit, which was published today and shows marked inequalities in British society: is there the will in the country to change? The prime minister says the necessary change will take time.
That call is followed by one from a black woman who says she’s taken a surname that sounds more western European than African and refers to bias in employment. May says some employers are putting in place “name-blind” policies. She says she’s not sure about legislation on that but she’d hope the audit will at least lead people to see the problem.
The presenter, Iain Dale, puts it to May that her colleagues have taken advantage of her looking weak on the conference stage. May says she has had a positive reaction and that “leadership is not about one speech”.
The prime minister also declines to directly criticise Grant Shapps, the former party chairman who raised the possibility of her leaving Number 10, saying disagreements happen in politics but should be discussed in private and people should support the party leader.
May says neither did she think about how difficult it was going to be to get through the rest of the speech once her cough started because there were issues she wanted to talk about.
Theresa May appears on LBC
The prime minister, Theresa May, is giving her first interview since her trying conference speech last week.
She says she was not initially sure how to react when approached by the prankster, Simon Brodkin, but did not consider the possibility she was under threat.
Updated
Sturgeon's speech - Snap verdict
That was as speech that showed Nicola Sturgeon has been listening. She repeated made the point that Scottish government policies are being implemented as a result of decisions taken at previous SNP conferences - a testament to the apparent power of activists that you would never hear from a Conservative prime minister (or any of the New Labour ones). More importantly, though, it showed she had been listening to voters. It does seem that a sizeable proportion of Scots did not like the SNP’s preoccupation with independence, and this was a speech that focused on pragmatic, mostly non-ideological reform. She left it to Angus Robertson to give the stirring ‘#indyref2 will happen’ message. She just seemed to say it might happen. In the meantime, she is getting on with her job.
That’s all from me for today.
A colleague will be taking over to cover Theresa May’s LBC phone-in at 5pm.
Updated
Here is Sturgeon’s peroration.
The late Canon Kenyon Wright once said this:
“There is another way. It is marked ‘The Road of Hope’. Hope for a new nation at ease with its past, confident in its present and hopeful for its future.”
This is the time to believe in and work for that better future.
To put ourselves firmly in the driving seat of our own destiny.
That is what the people of Scotland deserve.
That is what we will deliver.
Sturgeon turns to the timing of the next independence referendum.
I have always said, Scotland should have the right to choose our future when the terms of Brexit are clear.
We have a mandate to give the people that choice.
That mandate was won fairly and squarely.
But exercising it must be done with the interests of all of Scotland at heart.
People want clarity about Brexit first.
We respect that.
But to all of you here in this hall and across our country who are impatient for change, let me say this.
We may not yet know exactly when the choice will be made.
But we can, we must, and we will always make the case for independence.
(This is notably less committal than Angus Robertson was earlier. He said there would be a second referendum. See 3.29pm. Sturgeon is just saying there might be one.)
Sturgeon says Westminster has acted against the interests of Scotland. She cites three examples.
Over the years, there have been many decisions taken at Westminster that I disagree with.
But in the course of my lifetime, there have been three defining moments when a decision taken there has changed fundamentally our country’s path.
In all three, Scotland’s interests have been cast aside.
In the 1970s, when oil was discovered in the North Sea Westminster had a decision to make - set up an oil fund or not. They chose not to.
Independent Norway took a different decision.
Last month, their oil fund topped one trillion dollars.
One trillion reminders that taking your own decisions is better than letting others take them for you.
After the financial crash, Westminster was faced with another choice.
Stimulate the economy or impose austerity.
They chose austerity.
The result has been a £3 billion cut to Scotland’s budget, the dismantling of the welfare state and thousands more children growing up in poverty.
It is shameful.
And now, Westminster is pursuing the hardest possible Brexit, knowing that it will make us all poorer.
Just think if those decisions had been taken in Scotland.
The difference could be dramatic.
The security of a multi-billion pound oil fund.
Investment, not Tory-imposed austerity
And a country at the heart of Europe.
Sturgeon says the SNP are the party of independence.
And we are the party of independence.
The case for independence doesn’t depend on Brexit.
But Brexit does show us what can happen when we don’t control our own future.
Sturgeon criticises the EU for not speaking out against the Spanish government’s actions in Catalonia
When the people of Catalonia - EU citizens - were violently attacked by police just for trying to vote, the EU should have spoken up, loudly, to condemn it.
Friends,
In Catalonia, I hope dialogue will replace confrontation.
It is time for the Spanish government to sit down with the government of Catalonia.
It is time for them to talk and to find a way forward.
A way forward that respects the rule of law, yes.
But a way forward that also respects democracy and the right of the people of Catalonia to determine their own future.
Sturgeon condemns the EU withdrawal bill as a “blatant power grab”.
Sturgeon confirms that, if the UK government says EU nationals must pay a fee to stay in the UK, the Scottish government will pay it for public sector workers.
And she says Scotland should take control of immigration policy.
An immigration policy designed to appease UKIP must go.
A Scottish policy that meets Scotland’s needs and lives up to Scotland’s values must take its place.
It is time to give control of immigration policy to our own Scottish Parliament.
Sturgeon says her party is “internationalist to its core”.
And she confirms her opposition to nuclear weapons.
So let us restate this today.
No ifs, no buts from the SNP.
We say no to weapons of mass destruction.
We say no to nuclear weapons on the River Clyde, or anywhere else.
Sturgeon says there is a “bankruptcy at the heart of this Tory government”.
It is a moral one.
The rape clause.
The misery being caused to so many by the shambles that is Universal Credit.
Treatment of disabled people so appalling that the UN brands it a human catastrophe.
And all the while tax cuts handed to those who earn the most.
That is Tory austerity.
Heartless, shameful, self defeating.
Sturgeon hints that taxes may rise
Sturgeon turns to taxation.
The prospect of more Tory austerity and the impact of Brexit pose growing threats to our public services and the most vulnerable in our society.
That means it is right to consider how our limited tax powers might help us protect what we value most.
As we do so, this question will be centre stage.
What kind of country do we want to be?Too often, the debate on tax is framed as the economy versus public services.
That’s wrong.
Our taxes pay for the support that our businesses need to thrive just as they do for our health service and our schools.
And our competitiveness as a country is about more than just our tax rates.
It depends on the strength of our public services, the skills of our people and the quality of our infrastructure.
It is a fact that a good society needs a strong economy.
But let’s never forget this.
No economy will reach its full potential without a strong, fair, inclusive society.
And that’s what our government will always work to protect.
(This seems to be pitch rolling - do use David Cameron’s term - for an announcement in the budget later this year that some taxes will go up.)
Updated
Sturgeon says the free sanitary products for schools pledges will come in from the next academic year.
And last month we announced free sanitary products for all in our schools, colleges and universities.
Conference
I can announce today that this groundbreaking commitment to tackle the gender injustice of period poverty will be delivered from the start of the new academic year next August.
Sturgeon confirms that the 1% public sector pay cap will be lifted.
To our nurses, teachers, police officers, firefighters - to all of our dedicated public sector workers - let me reiterate this commitment today.
Next year, we will seek pay deals that are affordable but also fair.
The 1% pay cap will be lifted.
Sturgeon announces £6m rural tourism infrastructure fund
Sturgeon says the government wants to help islands and rural communities.
The Scottish government is determined to help.
So I am pleased to announce today that we will establish a new £6 million Rural Tourism Infrastructure Fund.
It will take bids from communities and work with local councils.
And it will allow even more people to enjoy this, the most beautiful country in the world.
Island of Ulva to be taken into community ownership, Sturgeon says
Sturgeon turns to land reform.
Exactly 20 years ago, the people of Eigg bought their island from its owner.
And so started Scotland’s modern journey of land reform.
That journey continues today.
In recent months Ulva, an island off the west coast of Mull, has sought permission to follow in Eigg’s footsteps.
If permission is granted, the residents can get on with raising the money needed.
Conference
The Scottish government has carefully considered the application.
And I am delighted to announce that we have today granted permission to the people of Ulva to bring their island into community ownership.
Sturgeon promises creation of publicly owned energy company
Sturgeon says the Scottish government will set up a publicly owned energy company.
In our manifesto last year, we also pledged to explore the option of a new publicly owned energy company.
The idea, at its heart, is simple.
Energy would be bought wholesale or generated here in Scotland – renewable, of course – and sold to customers as close to cost price as possible.
No shareholders to worry about.
No corporate bonuses to consider.
It would give people – particularly those on low incomes – more choice and the option of a supplier whose only job is to secure the lowest price for consumers.
Conference
We will set out more detail when we publish our new energy strategy.
But I am delighted to announce today that - by the end of this parliament - we will set up a publicly owned, not for profit energy company.
(Jeremy Corbyn promised something similar in the Labour manifesto.)
Sturgeon says she wants Scotland to be a leader in green technology.
We will end the need for new petrol and diesel vehicles by 2032 - 8 years ahead of the rest of the UK.
An ambitious target, but one we know can be met.
In 2007, we pledged that by 2020, 50% of the electricity we consume would come from renewable sources.
Last year, ahead of schedule, we achieved 54%.
That’s great for our environment.
And the lesson for our economy is this - by leading the way in using new technology, we send a message to the world that Scotland is the best place to develop it.
Already, we are home to the largest tidal power array in the world.
And next week, we will celebrate a new global first.
I will officially open the world’s largest floating windfarm, situated right here in Scotland, off the coast at Peterhead.
Sturgeon says Scotland’s first low emission zone will be in Glasgow
Sturgeon says Scotland’s first low emission zone will be in Glasgow.
In that programme, we committed to setting up Low Emissions Zones in our four biggest cities by 2020, to improve the quality of the air that we breathe.
The first of these will be in place by the end of next year and I am very pleased to announce today that it will be located here in the city of Glasgow.
Sturgeon says Scotland will meet its climate change targets. And she takes a swipe at Donald Trump.
We will meet our obligations under the Paris Accord.
Conference
Every industrialised country, large or small, must play its part to meet our collective duty to safeguard the environment.
And let me be blunt about this.
That applies just as much to the White House as it does to Bute House.
Sturgeon says young care leavers will be exempt from paying council tax
Sturgeon turns to children in care.
Last year, I set out plans for a fundamental review of the care system.
We want it to have love at its heart.
We are also delivering practical help to level the playing field for care leavers - like full grants and guaranteed places for those with the grades to go to university.
We want to make life a little bit easier for those leaving care.
So I can announce today a further step.
We will change the law so that all young care leavers are exempt from paying council tax.
Sturgeon is now announcing the doubling of the funding for free nursery care. Again, this was briefed overnight. See 8.58am.
Sturgeon is now talking about early years.
The Scottish government’s baby boxes are beautiful, she says, not just because of what they are, but because of what they say.
It is beautiful because of what it says.
All children are born equal. All children are valued. All children deserve the same start in life.
Photograph: Scottish Government/PA
Sturgeon is now delivering the passage released overnight about looking ahead to the next 10 years. (See 8.42am.)
Sturgeon says the Scottish government will deliver 50,000 more affordable homes over the course of this parliament.
We are backing our commitment with record investment.
£3 billion in this parliament - almost 80% more than in the last five years.
We’ve already set out how much money councils will be allocated each year.
And we will not allow any of it to be diverted to other priorities.
Let me make this clear to every council today.
If you don’t use all of your allocation to deliver new housing, we will take back the balance and give it to one that can.
Sturgeon says the last Labour government build just six council houses.
So 8 years ago, we started a new generation of council house building.
And since then, we’ve built 8,500 council houses.
Overall, we are building new social housing at a faster rate than any other part of the UK.
Sturgeon says the SNP has settled this issue.
Politicians elsewhere in the UK argue about whether fees should be frozen, reduced or abolished altogether.
We’ve settled that issue.
We abolished tuition fees. We restored education as a right.
And we now have record numbers of young people going to university.
Sturgeon says the SNP is showing the way for the rest of the UK.
Last week, Theresa May said she would freeze tuition fees in England.
She said they won’t rise above £9,250.
Well, I can announce today that we will match that commitment.
We will also freeze tuition fees.
But we will freeze them at zero.
Sturgeon says the Scottish government has rebuild infrastructure.
Look and travel across our wonderful country - the evidence is all around us.
Improved rail connections the length and breadth of Scotland...
The new Aberdeen bypass, upgrading the M8...
Dualling the A9 and making it our first electric-enabled highway...
Superfast broadband being extended to 100% of premises.
Conference
We are connecting Scotland for the 21st century and beyond.
Sturgeon says as long as the SNP is in office, the NHS will always be in public hands.
As in health, so too in education.
In our schools, higher passes are up by almost a third.
Ten years ago, just 12% of young people in this city left school with 3 Highers.
Today, it is 30% and rising.
Now we are reforming school education - empowering headteachers and delivering more money direct to the classroom.
Friends
I said we would close the attainment gap in our schools - and, mark my words, that is exactly what we are going to do.
Sturgeon says Scottish Labour is having its seemingly annual leadership election. Hypocrites, barrel scrappers - that is not what the SNP are calling them, but what they call each other.
She says the Tories are in third place. And the racism and misogyny in their ranks has been on full display.
Ruth Davidson should “find some backbone and kick the racists and the bigots out of her party”, she says.
(That is a reference to this row.)
Sturgeon says Glasgow was run by Labour for decades. In May the SNP took over. The “cronies and time-servers are out”, she says.
A school janitor dispute, that had been rumbling on for ages, was quickly settled, she says.
It may take a bit of time to fix Labour’s mess. “But fix it we will.”
Sturgeon says the three years she has been leader can be described in many ways. “Dull isn’t one of them,” she says.
There have been many elections, but the SNP has won them all.
She says they lost good MPs at the election, and thanks them for their service.
But she has a reality check: the SNP is polling higher than at the same point after its victories in 2007 and 2011.
Ten years into government, the verdict of the Scottish people is clearer than ever: they trust the SNP, she says.
Sturgeon pays tribute to Gordon Wilson, the former SNP leader who died this year.
In 1979, when he became leader, he was one of just two SNP MPs.
It was a tough time. But his groundwork paved the way for future success. His influence “cannot be overstated”, she says.
Nicola Sturgeon's speech
Nicola Sturgeon thanks Robertson. He has seen and heard “just how much we all love you.”
She says, at the risk of tempting fate, “I’ve come prepared.” She holds up a box of Strepsils.
Updated
Robertson is rattling through some of the Scottish government’s achievements.
And he introduces Nicola Sturgeon.
Robertson says another Scottish independence referendum will happen
Robertson urges members, here and watching at home, to go map out a plan for their constituencies.
There are 1,300-plus days until the next Scottish elections. And he says:
And there will also be a referendum on Scottish independence.
This gets a huge round of applause.
Robertson says this is not just down to chance.
It is because of the hard work of its members and its leaders.
But Roberston says the SNP cannot simply re-run the same approach at future elections.
The next Scottish elections are not due until 2021.
That gives it a chance to reach out, he says.
He says 70% of 17 to 24-year-olds support independence. These should be natural SNP voters, he says.
He says the SNP must get beyond voter identification, and find out what matters to voters.
Everybody has a part to play, he says.
Robertson says the most recent polls show SNP support up, and 17 points ahead of Labour’s. The Tories are even further behind, he says.
He says that makes the SNP one of the most successful parties anywhere.
Roberston says it was an honour to lead the SNP group at Westminster.
The SNP group still has more MPs than all other parties added together in Scotland.
And the SNP has more more members in Scotland than the Tories and the Lib Dems do in the UK as a whole.
Robertson says SNP committed to delivering Scottish independence 'as soon as we can'
Robertson says the SNP is committed to delivering Scottish independence “as soon as we can”.
Updated
Roberston says the SNP returned the highest percentage of candidates of any party in Britain.
When he was first elected as an MP there were five of them. Now there are seven times that number.
Robertson says he wants to be totally unapologetic: the last decade as been amazing for the SNP, and for Scottish democratic life.
The SNP has the most members at Holyrood and at Westminster, and the most councillors, he says.
He says it has won the last seven elections in a row, at all levels - local elections, Scottish elections, European elections and Westminster elections.
And it still won a majority of MPs in Scotland, something neither the Tories nor Labour could do across the UK.
Angus Robertson's speech
Angus Robertson, the SNP’s deputy leader, is starting his speech now.
Speech from @theSNP's Depute @AngusRobertson coming up. #SNP17 pic.twitter.com/0417Ym3FY4
— Catriona Matheson (@_cmatheson) October 10, 2017
The conference has passed a topical resolution calling for a ban o use mosquito anti-loitering devices, which emit a high-frequency sound which is supposedly only audible to teenagers. Christina McKelvie MSP said that they could be heard by babies, older people, and people with autism and that they breached the human rights of young people.
This is from the Times’ Dan Sanderson.
Stewards at #snp17 demanding delegates move to front rows to make hall appear more full for Nicola Sturgeon speech. pic.twitter.com/eYCFGRGl98
— Dan Sanderson (@DSandersonTimes) October 10, 2017
At the SNP conference a video has been shown making a charity appeal on behalf of the Rohingya crisis appeal.
V pleased we played @decappeal vid featuring @rizmc at #SNP17 - ScotGovt already peldged aid to help Rohingyas. You can too txt CRISIS 70000 pic.twitter.com/50WZeQqx3f
— Humza Yousaf (@HumzaYousaf) October 10, 2017
Scottish Labour has responded to Mhairi Black’s speech. (See 2pm.) This is from the Labour MP Danielle Rowley. She said:
Mhairi Black’s anti-austerity posturing would be a bit more credible if she once had spoken out about the £1.5bn the SNP government had cut from local services across Scotland, or effectively stood up to to plans to downgrade the children’s ward at the Royal Alexandra Hospital in her own constituency.
What this embarrassing rant reveals is that the SNP has no response to the growing number of people who see that radical change is possible within the UK with a Labour government led by Jeremy Corbyn.
Delegates pass a resolution congratulating the Scottish government for its effort to protect and improve mental health in the workplace. One of the most moving speeches came from Alan Bithell, who spoke with dignity about his own difficulties. He told delegates:
Why the workplace should not be as safe for our mental health as for our physical health I do not know.
Bithell recalled being at work and told he would have to work an extra two hours. He said he could not, because he needed to see his counsellor. He was told that that was not important, and that if he did not stay on, he would be disciplined.
Bithell went on:
I know the things that damage my mental health and the things that help it. Completing a task for someone who appreciates it is a huge boost for my mental health.
Work can be a great therapy. When going to work means facing constant criticism and threats from your line manager you will never be able to give your best, regardless of the state of your mental health.
In my bad times I have some very convincing arguments that I should not be allowed to continue to exist. Going to work should not mean having these uncontrollable thoughts reinforced.
I bring with me some useful skills and an eagerness to work. In doing my work I am fighting against my brain trying to destroy me. I fight very hard. The fact that that means a lot of work gets done for my employer is a secondary benefit.
This is from Maree Todd MSP.
Superb 1st conference speech from @AlanBithell1 - very moving personal testimony. Proud to know you! Go Sutherland SNP #SNP17 pic.twitter.com/8gjkDCFHwr
— Maree Todd MSP (@MareeToddSNP) October 10, 2017
The Daily Politics’ Emma Vardy has been surveying conference delegates to find out if they favour raising taxes to pay for better services. Overall they did, although it was relatively balanced and the number of people backing “hike it” was not that much larger than the number voting for “hold it”.
(The SNP government, as Nicola Sturgeon signalled again in her Holyrood magazine interview [see 12pm] seems to be in the “hike it” camp.
SNP conference: Delegates asked about tax raising powers https://t.co/WrnJFYQRRC
— BBC Politics (@BBCPolitics) October 10, 2017
Delegates have just passed a resolution congratulating the Scottish government on being the first in the world to provide free sanitary products to women on low incomes and calling for VAT to be abolished for sanitary products, including incontinence pads and breast pads.
Meanwhile, the UK government has released a collection of statistics showing the huge effect of people’s ethnic background on their life experiences.
The ethnicity facts and figures website covers 130 areas including health, education, employment and the criminal justice system. It shows that black people are more than three times as likely to be arrested as their white peers.
White British and Indian people are the most likely to be homeowners.
But among children eligible for free school meals, those of white British origin were the least likely to reach expected academic standards.
The conference has resumed, and the results of internal elections have been announced. The two parliamentarians elected to the SNP’s national executive committee are Stewart McDonald and Tommy Sheppard.
We all like getting a herogram from the boss. Mhairi Black has received the equivalent, because Nicola Sturgeon has posted this on Twitter.
This speech from @MhairiBlack is well worth a read. #SNP17 https://t.co/uXH9gRvxZ0
— Nicola Sturgeon (@NicolaSturgeon) October 10, 2017
Sturgeon was referring to this BuzzFeed write-up of Black’s speech.
The UK's youngest MP absolutely rinsed Jeremy Corbyn at the SNP conference https://t.co/Ns8AVFdTrc
— BuzzFeed UK Politics (@BuzzFeedUKPol) October 10, 2017
Here are some pictures of the queue to get into the conference hall for Nicola Sturgeon’s speech this afternoon.
The queue for Nicola Sturgeon's speech -2 hrs from now. At the front they joke they've been promised free sandwiches pic.twitter.com/LMcogQOMsD
— iain watson (@iainjwatson) October 10, 2017
Big queues ahead of @NicolaSturgeon speech in 90 mins or so pic.twitter.com/he17465QqZ
— Nick Eardley (@nickeardleybbc) October 10, 2017
The queue for Nicola Sturgeon’s speech in two hours is absolutely nuts. pic.twitter.com/EQmQ365BaP
— Jamie Ross (@JamieRoss7) October 10, 2017
Here is a clip from Mhairi Black’s speech.
And this is what the SNP MP Alison Thewliss said in the debate on the Sovereign Grant Act as she seconded the resolution.
If you are the royal couple and you have a third child, Theresa May will congratulate you. If you are a poor person on tax credits and you have a tid child, the Tories will condemn you. We need to think about the injustice and unfairness of this.
SNP members back call for Queen to lose state funding
Here are some more quotes from the Sovereign Grant Act debate.
- SNP delegates have voted for the Queen to lose her state funding. The vote will have no practical impact, because the Sovereign Grant Act, which the resolution said should be repealed (see 12.06pm), is a matter for Westminster. And Derek Mackay, the Scottish government’s finance minister, said the move would not affect his government’s plans to change the way the Crown Estate is managed in Scotland. (See 12.31pm.) But the debate allowed delegates to complain about the inequality epitomise by the royals. Julie Hepburn, who opened the debate, said it was not about the monarchy, but about how public assets are used. But she went on:
I don’t support a constitutional role or the provision of public funding for the monarchy. But, until such time as we are given a choice in the matter, the UK government will continue to fund them with public money - our money.
After explaining how the Sovereign Grant Act works (see here for a briefing) she went on:
It is basically the equivalent of the royal family winning the lottery every single year. No need for the royal family to play Euromillions. With the sovereign grant, Her Majesty is purring all the way to the bank.
She said the grant had gone up from £31m “which is not to be sniffed at - that is a good rate of pay for charity work - to a whopping £76.1m in 2017.”
And don’t be fooled by the whole percentage profits, like it’s extra money coming from somewhere. That is pure smoke and mirrors. It is just a funding formula ...
This is our money, money that could otherwise be spent on the public good. Under the sovereign grant system, there is no accountability for the size of the payments to the royal household, or any limitations to ensure proportionality. If profits double, the payments double.
At a time when the UK government is insisting we all tighten our belts, particularly the most vulnerable, because there is no money, there can be no moral justification for giving just one family over £70m. That could pay for a lot of mobility cars ...
We need to keep taking a step back, look up and look out, and see how ordinary people are being shafted by a rich elite and how the odds are always stacked in favour of the most privileged in our society.
The sovereign grant is the epitome of that privilege, and a symbol of everything that is rotten at the core of the UK’s political system.
So let’s ensure that public assets like the Crown Estate are used to benefit us all, not just a privileged few. Repeal of the Sovereign Grant Act would be a start.
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Derek Mackay, the Scottish government’s finance minister who was chairing this morning’s session, told the conference just before the resolution was passed that it would not change the Scottish government’s policy, as set out in the manifesto. That was to return a proportion of revenue from the Crown Estates in Scotland back to local communities.
He was referring to the SNP’s 2016 manifesto for the Scottish elections. It said:
We will keep the Crown Estate as an ongoing entity until further public consultation on its future has taken place and ensure a smooth transition for tenants of the Crown Estates’ four rural estates at Glenlivet, Applegirth, Whitehill and Fochabers.
We will ensure that Scotland’s coastal and island communities get to control and decide how to invest 100 per cent of net revenues raised from Crown Estate marine assets out to 12 nautical miles.
In January this year the Scottish government launched a consultation on the management of the Crown Estate in Scotland.
The resolution has been passed overwhelmingly.
Graeme McCormick is opposing the resolution. It is “futile”, he says. He says the SNP should have debating the future of the monarchy.
He says Scotland should have a constitutional convention, to let the public decide who they want as head of state.
Brian Nugent tells the conference says money from the Crown Estate in Shetland was meant to go to Shetland. He says the SNP motion talks about the money going to “the wider public good”, which suggests that it would not benefit local communities.
SNP debates resolution to cut state funding for royal family
The conference is now debating a resolution that would cut state funding for the royal family.
Here is the full text.
Conference notes that the Sovereign Grant Act 2011 changed the way the Royal Household is supported financially by the state, scrapping the previous Civil List and Grants-in-Aid system with a method that pays the Royal Household a proportion of Crown Estate profits, including a guarantee that this Sovereign Grant will not fall from the previous year and is rounded up to the nearest £100,000.
Conference further notes that this has resulted in the Royal Household receiving a significantly larger income year on year from the state, from the initial Sovereign Grant of £31 million in 2012-13 to £76.1 million in 2017-18.
Conference believes that profits from the Crown Estate, which is a public asset, should be spent on the wider public good.
Conference therefore resolves to support the repeal of the Sovereign Grant Act 2011.
Introducing the resolution, Julie Hepbern said this was not about whether or not the SNP back the royal family. It was about how public money is spent.
Explaining how the Sovereign Grant Act works, she said:
It is the equivalent of the royal family winning the lottery every year.
Delegates have passed a resolution criticising the UK government for introducing mandatory voter ID at election, on the grounds that it could discourage voting. The resolution also calls for measures to increase voter turn out, such as automatic enrolment on the electoral register.
Holyrood magazine has published a long interview with Nicola Sturgeon. The most interesting passage is the one where she discusses tax, and explains why, up until now, she has been reluctant to use Scotland’s powers to increase taxes.
But circumstances have now changed, she says. This is what she says in response to a question about why the Scottish government is now consulting on increasing tax.
What’s changed? Well, we’ve seen the Brexit implications start to loom, which are going to inevitably have an impact on our economy, we are clearly facing continued Tory austerity, which has an impact on our own public spending and at the same time, rightly, given rising inflation, we want to reward our public sector workers better. Put together, all of that says we need to take a better look at how we could use tax powers to progressively help create the kind of country we want to be: good public services, good support for business, well rewarded public servants and a good strong social contract with free tuition and the benefits that people value.
I don’t want to put people’s taxes up, and I make no apology for that, but sometimes the income tax debate over the past couple of years in Scotland has seemed, on the part of some people, to be like kids playing with a new toy – we’ve got it so we have to use it. Decisions that politicians make about tax should always be very, very carefully taken because a decision I make about tax is paid for by taxpayers across the country who are already grappling with all sorts of pressures on their household finances. So, I make no apology for being quite cautious on tax, I think it’s the right thing to do ...
But we don’t have full power of the income tax system, we have power to set bands and rates, so if we’re going to have an honest, frank debate about that ahead of the budget then it should focus on the whole of that debate, not just a small part of it.
Every tax decision you take is a balance and it’s why I have been very mindful when talking about the 50p rate and doing it just in Scotland without all of the powers over tax avoidance and tax evasion, to ask, do you end up losing more revenue than you raise? So, as I say, I don’t apologise for being very considered around these decisions because you’ve got to get the judgements absolutely right.
Richard Leonard, the Corbynite candidate for the Scottish Labour leadership, has issued a “charge sheet” accusing Nicola Sturgeon of failing to justify her “plausible and even progressive” claims to stand up for the poor.
Now favourite to beat Anas Sarwar, the centrist candidate backed by the Scottish party’s senior figures, Leonard has been attracting support from younger left-wing voters who backed independence in 2014.
They like Leonard’s explicit support for Corbyn’s agenda, but are troubled by his staunch backing for the UK. Playing to that vote, Leonard said under the SNP 140,000 people were on housing waiting lists; council funding cut by £1.8bn; 19% of children in Scotland lived in poverty; economic growth was flatlining.
In his statement, Leonard wrote:
Under the SNP the Scottish parliament has in too many areas been used as a conveyor belt to implement Tory cuts. Whatever way you dress it up the SNP have been the Tories executioner’s assistant for public services in Scotland.
Being too busy fighting the constitutional fight the SNP have literally forgotten to get on with doing the things that really matter to the people of Scotland. It is a tragedy that they have not fought and obsessed over tackling poverty in the same way they have fought and obsessed over constitutional change.
I will never make that mistake; my overriding mission will be focused on fighting poverty and inequality and sharing the fruits of our economy much more evenly.
Black says the Scots are up against an establishment that was once the most powerful in the world.
You could say the Scots are up against a Goliath, she says. But she remembers who won that one.
So let’s get out and fight for independence, she concludes.
Black says the Labour party are a reminder to the SNP of what they must never become.
Black says the no campaign was based on lies.
The Scots are told they cannot eat flags. But they cannot eat broken promises either.
The UK is economically reckless. It is a sinking ship, she says.
And the idea that, because there has been one independence vote, there cannot be another is “utterly ridiculous”.
Black says Scotland may not know where it is going. But it “sure as hell” knows what it is walking away from.
Black says more than one in four of Scottish children live in poverty.
Families earn less than when the Tories came to power, she says.
It has been the worst decade for wage growth since the Napoleonic war, she says.
She says the Tories are knowingly driving people into debt and poverty and hunger.
The real question is, can Scotland afford not to be independent?
Black says the importance of effective media as a critical component of democracy cannot be underestimated.
So why was Ruth Davidson invited on the Andrew Marr Show to talk about the SNP conference when the SNP were not invited on to the programme to the talk about the Tory one.
She says Catalonia gets its own 24-hour broadcasting channel. Scotland should have its own broadcaster too, she says.
Black says she is sick of British nationalists saying Scotland is not big enough to survive on its own.
Why would Westminster genuinely want to keep us if we were a financial burden?
Mhairi Black MP is speaking now. She starts by saying she is suffering from a cough. (It’s a Theresa May joke.)
She says she was humbled to to be re-elected again. People ask what she felt about losing votes to Labour. She did not mind, she says, because Labour had copied some of the SNP’s policies.
She says she was encouraged by the election of Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader. But she is “so disappointed” by what he has done. Corbyn wants to scrap tuition fees, but Labour is increasing them in Wales, she says. And Labour is still committed to wasting billions of pounds on nuclear weapons.
She also accuses Corbyn of coming to Scotland and “condescending” the Scots, by criticising them over welfare when the Scottish government does not have full powers over welfare. And Labour voted not to give them these powers, she says.
Yousaf is now criticising Boris Johnson. He is “beyond a joke”, he says.
And he says the SNP are the only progressive government on these islands.
Humza Yousaf, the Scottish government’s transport minister, is speaking now.
He says the SNP’S ambition is not to make Scotland the best small country in the world. It is to make it the best country in the world.
There is no greater threat to the world than climate change, he says. But he says he rejects the claim that protecting the environment will be bad for Scotland’s economy.
I have two words for the Tory party: Frack off ...
Under the SNP’s watch there will be no fracking in Scotland.
He says Labour criticism of the SNP policy amounts to “SNP bad”.
If the SNP invented the lightbulb, Labour would accuse them of inventing an anti-candle device, he says.
Delegates have passed the resolution calling for nuclear weapons to be decommissioned unanimously.
The conference is now debating a resolution calling for the decommissioning of nuclear weapons. It also says the UK government should implement a policy of no first use of nuclear weapons.
The UK government does not rule out the first use of nuclear weapons. Here is an extract from a government paper published two years ago explaining this.
We deliberately maintain some ambiguity about precisely when, how and at what scale we would contemplate use of our nuclear deterrent. We do not want to simplify the calculations of a potential aggressor by defining more precisely the circumstances in which we might consider the use of our nuclear capabilities (for example, we do not define what we consider to be our vital interests), hence, we will not rule in or out the first use of nuclear weapons.
In the debate on universal credit George Adam MSP said the Westminster government “quite clearly doesn’t care”. He told the conference:
This debate is quite simple. It is between what is right and what is quite clearly very wrong. There’s a difference between a Scottish government in Edinburgh that believes that communities should support those than need it at the time and one in Westminster that quite clearly doesn’t care. It’s that simple.
The journalist Lesley Riddoch has some more quotes from the debate on Twitter.
Drew Hendry tells #snp17 case of single mum with cancer facing eviction cos of Universal Credit failures. Highland pilot has been disaster.
— Lesley Riddoch (@LesleyRiddoch) October 10, 2017
Universal credit delays mean 1/10 claimants use loan sharks to survive. Jeanne Freeman tells #SNP17 Scotparl sd have powers 2 undo damage
— Lesley Riddoch (@LesleyRiddoch) October 10, 2017
Terminally ill people cannot claim Universal credit w/o verifying they r about to die. @MareeToddSNP voice shaking with emotion at #snp17
— Lesley Riddoch (@LesleyRiddoch) October 10, 2017
Not about making work pay but making benefits punish. @MareeToddSNP challenges Ruth Davidson 2 oppose universal credit rollout at #snp17
— Lesley Riddoch (@LesleyRiddoch) October 10, 2017
The resolution, saying the roll out of universal credit should be halted immediately until the system is reformed, was passed unanimously.
The conference proceedings have just started. Drew Hendry MP is opening the first debate, on a resolution saying the roll out of universal credit should be halted.
The resolution says the Scottish government is using “its very limited powers over flexibilities of universal credit to ensure there is choice over direct payments to landlords and twice monthly payments”.
Angus Robertson, the Scottish National party’s former Westminster leader and one of its few heavy-hitters, will reemerge on the political stage this afternoon for the first time since his shock defeat by the Tories in June’s snap election.
In most parties, losing a seat means enforced retirement or five years in the shadows until another constituency can be found. Not so with Robertson. He is due to introduce Nicola Sturgeon’s keynote speech at 3.20, in his first speech since the election.
Despite losing his seat in Moray, he is staying on as the party’s deputy leader (an unpaid post) and is being primed for a leading role within the SNP, tasked with reinvigorating the party’s 120,000 members, capacity-building and preparing its activists for a putative second independence vote. One date on the horizon is late 2018, when Sturgeon is due to update Holyrood on her plans for a new referendum.
Observers and insiders say this is preparation for a return to frontline politics: a Holyrood seat is mooted, perhaps replacing Roseanna Cunningham, the Scottish environment secretary, said to be mulling retirement as MSP for Perthshire South and Kinross-shire in 2021.
Some speculate he is the most obvious party leader should Sturgeon step down, despite her apparent hints she plans ten more years. Several Holyrood frontbenchers, transport minister Humza Yousaf and finance secretary Derek Mackay, may see themselves as contenders.
Robertson has never served in government, a significant gap in his CV, but helped orchestrate successive SNP election campaigns and repeatedly outperformed Jeremy Corbyn at PMQs with forensic, focused questions. Succession-planning may seem premature, but the SNP of today does not suffer fratricidal or factional wars. Its prime objective is remaining in power for the long term.
Here is the Times’ Kenny Farquharson on Nicola Sturgeon’s childcare announcement. (See 8.58am.)
Sturgeon's extra £420m for childcare is a heads-up that we're heading for a tax rise in the Scottish budget in December.
— Kenny Farquharson (@KennyFarq) October 10, 2017
There has been a lot of comment at this conference to the effect that the SNP have suffered a bit of a setback. My colleague Martin Kettle reflects that in his Guardian column today.
But, as Martin himself points out, the SNP is still the leading party in Scotland. They suffered a setback at the general election, but they remain dominant.
For background, here are two charts from the House of Commons library briefing paper about the general election result (pdf) that put the party’s election performance in context.
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In his Good Morning Scotland interview Mike Russell, the Scottish government’s Brexit minister, also said there was no prospect of the UK becoming a “glorious trading nation” after leaving the European Union.
Referring to the way Downing Street and the European commission are both claiming the ball is in the other’s court, in relation to the Brexit talks, he told the programme:
It sounds like Wimbledon rather than the serious negotiation it needs to be.
It is the UK which has chosen to leave the EU, clearly they have to come up with the proposals for discussion.
If they are refusing to come up with the proposals and now openly talking about not taking part in negotiation and walking, that’s a new degree of seriousness and it will cause enormous difficulty.
This is a fantasy, they [the UK government] are pursuing a fantasy, there isn’t a good Brexit.
It’s no secret we don’t agree with the policy, the policy was not voted for by Scotland.
It is based upon a fantasy of the UK - some buccaneering, glorious trading nation - which just doesn’t exist and can’t exist, and it’s important to say that.
Brexit Secretary Michael Russell @Feorlean live from @theSNP conference #bbcgms 0810 pic.twitter.com/LyUYXUwZkG
— Gary Robertson (@BBCGaryR) October 10, 2017
Alex Rowley, the interim Scottish Labour leader, has responded to the trail of Nicola Sturgeon’s speech by accusing her of reheating a childcare announcement she first made in her speech to her party conference two years ago. In a statement he said:
Once again, Nicola Sturgeon has been forced to re-announce that education is her top priority - but the reality is schools are struggling under the SNP with 4,000 fewer teachers, 1,000 fewer support staff and an attainment gap that is as stubborn as ever.
The situation is now so bad that she has been forced to re-announce a commitment made two years ago.
Nicola Sturgeon should listen to teachers, unions, parents and the Scottish Labour party and stop the cuts to Scotland’s future.
On Good Morning Scotland this morning Mike Russell, the Scottish government’s Brexit minister, was asked how the Scottish government would fund its free childcare plan. (See 8.58am.) He said the details would be set out in the Scottish government’s budget later this year.
When the budget is published at the end of the year into next year, which is how the budgetary cycle goes, then you will see it laid out in the public accounts. It will tell you exactly where that money will come from.
Russell said the Scottish government had to “balance the books” because that was what the devolution settlement required.
As Nicola Sturgeon prepares for her keynote speech at SNP conference later on Tuesday, the latest YouGov poll offers further evidence that the pro-independence vote is getting softer, despite the significant risks of Brexit and Scotland’s 62% remain vote last year.
Bruised by the loss of 21 Westminster seats in June’s snap election, Sturgeon has dropped her demand for a second independence vote by spring 2019. She describes Brexit is a “slow motion car crash” that makes the case for independence even stronger, yet is resisting pressure from some activists to name a new date.
The YouGov poll for the Times, published yesterday, offers further evidence on why she remains cautious, at this stage at least.
It shows a significant minority of voters who backed independence in 2014 do not favour a new one in the near future. It found 21% of yes voters did not want one in the next five years, and 8% did not know; 16% of yes voters in 2014 now opposed independence.
There has been evidence that Brexit has pushed no voters in 2014 to back independence now. But YouGov found far fewer of those. Only 10% of no voters in 2014 now support yes; only 12% support a new referendum in the next five years.
Sturgeon has also struggled to convert pro-EU voters to independence. YouGov asked a question linking a new referendum to the UK’s Brexit deal being signed but before the UK left the EU, 47% of remain voters said yes but 43% said no.
That resistance grew when responses to the first question on staging an independence poll within five years was divided into remain and leave voters. On that question, 45% of pro-EU voters backed a new independence vote before 2022 while 48% said no.
These numbers matter: SNP delegates at this conference who voted leave have said a third of party members oppose EU membership after independence. It is doubtful all of those sceptics would vote no in a new independence referendum, but many might. So Sturgeon needs a large number of pro-EU no voters to switch sides, to guarantee victory if a new independence vote is held.
Some senior SNP figures, including Pete Wishart, the party’s longest serving MP, are calling instead for her to delay a decision until they can frame a compelling new “independence 2.0” proposition.
Another poll showing support for indy little changed since the referendum. Why we must start to craft the new case for independence 2.0.
— Pete Wishart (@PeteWishart) October 7, 2017
Ian Blackford, the SNP’s Westminster leader, agrees. He told the Guardian last week that fixing a new date before producing a new independence blueprint would be “put the cart before the horse”.
Sturgeon to spend £840m a year doubling free childcare to 30 hours per week
This is what Nicola Sturgeon is going to say in her speech about the Scottish government fully funding plans to double free childcare to 30 hours per week. According to the extracts released overnight she will say:
At the heart of all that we do is a determination to make Scotland the best place in the world to grow up.
Right now, we deliver around 16 hours of early education and childcare a week - generally, that’s either a morning or an afternoon session each day.
It means some parents still face a struggle to find and fund the childcare they need to allow them to work.
We are going to change that. By 2020, we will deliver around 30 hours a week for every three and four year old and eligible two year old.
It will give children the best start in life. And working parents will save around £350 a month on the costs of childcare.
Often when I have talked about this policy, I’ve been asked – sometimes sceptically – if we will really be able to fund it properly.
Well, today, we put our money where our mouth is. Over the past few months, we have undertaken detailed work to assess the investment needed.
Right now, we invest around £420m a year in early years education and childcare.
I can announce today that by the end of this parliament, that will rise to £840m a year.
This is a commitment unmatched anywhere else in the UK.
And it’s the best investment we can make in Scotland’s future.
Nicola Sturgeon tells party to prepare for 10 more years in power
It is the final day of the SNP conference and Nicola Sturgeon, the first minister, will wrap it up with a speech focusing on some of the long-term challenges facing Scotland in a “fast changing world”. The SNP has recognised that prioritising independence cost it votes at the general election and last month Sturgeon responded by setting out an ambitious programme for government. There is a summary of the many proposals in it here.
In her speech she will argue that the government needs “transformational” policies to address the problems ahead.
She will also tell the SNP to prepare for another 10 years or more in power. As the Herald reports, the Tories have accused her of “breath-taking arrogance”, although they may be mistaking rhetoric for conviction. Party leaders routinely say this sort of thing (although, to be fair to the Herald, Theresa May would be laughed out of the room if she gave a speech suggesting her government might be around until 2027.)
According to extracts from the speech released overnight, Sturgeon will say:
Over the past ten years, we have led the way. We should be proud of what we achieved.
Our focus now is on the next ten years and beyond. The world we live in today is changing at a faster pace than we have ever known.
The challenges we face are generational. Our responses must be transformational.
Last month we unveiled our programme for government – a new programme for a new Scotland.
It offers practical solutions to the daily concerns people have, and aims to equip our country to prosper in a fast changing world.
That world around us is being shaped by events that no country on its own can hope to completely control.
But we face the added uncertainty of a UK now being driven down the most uncertain path in modern times.
We know that Scotland does better when decisions are taken here in Scotland.
So as we look ahead we face a choice:
We can trail in the wake of the change that is coming – or we can choose to shape our own future.
Let’s resolve this today:
Let’s not wait for others to decide for us.
Let’s put Scotland in the driving seat.
As my colleague Severin Carrell reports in his overnight story, Sturgeon will also the the Scottish government’s pledge to double free childcare to 30 hours a week by 2021 (one of the proposals in the programme for government) will be fully funded, at a cost of £840m a year by 2021. I will post more on this soon.
Here is the agenda for the day.
10.30am: Debates on universal credit, nuclear weapons, voter registration and the Crown Estate.
11.15am: Humza Yousaf, the Scottish government’s minister for transport and the islands, and the MP Mhairi Black speak.
2pm: Debates on VAT on sanitary products, mental health in the workplace and job insecurity.
3.10pm: Angus Robertson, the SNP’s deputy leader, speaks.
3.20pm: Nicola Sturgeon speaks.
You can read all today’s Guardian politics stories here.
Here is the Politico Europe round-up of this morning’s political news from Jack Blanchard’s Playbook. And here is the PoliticsHome list of today’s top 10 must reads.
If you want to follow me or contact me on Twitter, I’m on @AndrewSparrow.
I try to monitor the comments BTL but normally I find it impossible to read them all. If you have a direct question, do include “Andrew” in it somewhere and I’m more likely to find it. I do try to answer direct questions, although sometimes I miss them or don’t have time.
If you want to attract my attention quickly, it is probably better to use Twitter.
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