JOHN Swinney has said he is looking at a “range of tactics” to “make it impossible” for the UK Government to refuse handing Scotland the powers to hold an independence referendum.
Earlier this week a majority of MSPs voted in favour of having the powers to hold a constitutional referendum devolved to Holyrood.
This request was swiftly rejected by the UK Government in under 15 minutes as a Downing Street spokesperson said there was no consensus for a vote.
But speaking exclusively to The National from Bute House, the First Minister said he was not prepared to let the UK Government off the hook with this “unacceptable” response when he meets Keir Starmer in the coming weeks.
If the Prime Minister continues to refuse signing off on a Section 30 order, Swinney has vowed to work to bring people together to make an “irrefutable demand” to the UK Government that Scotland must be able to decide her own future.
“I think what’s important is we don’t in any way shape or form let the UK Government off the hook,” said the First Minister.
“I’m very much aware of the swiftness with which the UK Government issued the response, but that is not acceptable. It’s not acceptable for the democratic wishes of the people of Scotland, either expressed in the election and then democratically by the parliament, to just be dismissed in such a casual fashion.
“So, before we just resign ourselves to the fact the UK Government is taking up this stance, we have to argue and press that case for Scotland to be able to decide our own future and that’s what I intend to do going forward.”
Pressed on what plan he has in mind if Starmer still does not budge on handing over powers for a referendum, Swinney said there needed to be a build-up of pressure on the UK Government from a grassroots movement.
“We’ve got to make it impossible for the UK Government to refuse the ability of Scottish Parliament to legislate on this question,” said Swinney.
“So there’s a whole host of things that have got to be done which will build up and strengthen that voice within Scotland about what needs to be done to make sure Scotland can control our own future.
“We’re now in a position where there are other voices in this debate simply saying this is ridiculous that the parliament is being denied the opportunity to put this question to the public and that the democratic wishes of the public are being ignored. Some of the voices that we’ve heard post-election, Paul Sweeney for one from the Labour Party, [are] indicating there has to be some form of process to enable Scotland to decide her own future.
“I think to anybody looking at Scottish politics today […] it’s crystal clear that this issue is not going to be resolved until the people are given the chance to determine on this question.”
Swinney said part of that build-up of pressure will be working to create “cohesion” within the Yes movement, adding: “This has got to be a grassroots movement that forces the UK Government to enable Scotland to decide on her own future.”
In 2023, the Alba Party proposed a “back-up” plan to consult the Scottish public on whether Holyrood should be given the powers to legislate for and negotiate independence before holding a constitutional referendum.
Asked whether this was a plan he would consider, Swinney stopped short of confirming he would hold such a poll but did say he intends to look at how he builds consensus around the right to self-determination.
“What I think is important is that we demonstrate very clearly and tangibly the intense pressure there is from Scotland for us to have the choice about our own future,” he said.
“So the things I’m looking at are about how I bring people together to points of agreement about this very question. How can I build consensus within Scotland that this is an issue that has to be addressed?
"That’s different from building support for independence, which is of course what I want to do and I will make that case, but there’s a different argument which is about the right of self-determination and that can involve many other people.
“That voice of the people of Scotland being able to decide their own constitutional future must be heard and that stretches beyond, I think, those who believe in independence, but [to] those who recognise there is a need for Scotland to be able to decide on her own constitutional future."
He went on: “I want to make sure that there is a breadth of support within Scotland that pressurises the UK Government so that Scotland can decide on the question of independence and I’ll explore a range of different tactics as to how I do that and build that up.
“I want to make sure I create a space for Scotland to come together and make that irrefutable demand of the UK Government.”
Following the guilty plea from former SNP chief executive Peter Murrell to embezzling more than £400,000 from the party after purchasing hundreds of items using SNP cash, Swinney was also quizzed on how the party did not realise this had been going on since 2010.
He told The National he was confident the party could not have done anymore to pick up on Murrell’s abuse of power due to the “widescale deception” taking place.
“The police statement on Monday was crystal clear that Peter Murrell went to extraordinary lengths to cover his tracks and as a consequence of that it was clear that there was widescale deception that was underway,” Swinney said.
“The police also said that what they had to undertake was an extraordinarily complex operation to detect all that had gone on to enable there to be such a strong prosecution case brought [forward].
“I think that demonstrates the scale of what was undertaken to deceive. So I don’t think the SNP could’ve looked in anymore detail because there was such extensive deception that was underway.
Swinney said the case had “horrified” him adding that he “cannot fathom how somebody could behave [like this] who was entrusted with taking forward the best interests of our movement”.
